Comments on: Pick an enemy, make community. http://www.christodeklerk.com/2007/03/20/pick-an-enemy-make-community/ Sun, 26 Apr 2009 21:14:21 -0700 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8 hourly 1 By: Veronica http://www.christodeklerk.com/2007/03/20/pick-an-enemy-make-community/comment-page-1/#comment-6094 Veronica Fri, 30 Mar 2007 00:41:27 +0000 http://www.christodeklerk.com/2007/03/20/pick-an-enemy-make-community/#comment-6094 true. but I rememeber Hans Boersma defining violence as more than that of a reaction to a threat or enemy or inflicting some sort of harm. Violence can be of other emotions or actions and not simply a reaction AGAINST something can't it? The violence of love perhaps? Just trying to get my head around why I don't see an enemy as necessary. But perhaps we are aiming at the same thing because even when there is a violence of say, love, there is also a forcible attempt at keeping out say, isolation or alienation. But it is more a forcible attempt to gain or keep something. And perhaps that in itself can cement a community. Something to strive for, not necessarily against. But if you're for something are you automatically against something else? Perhaps. Ramblings. true. but I rememeber Hans Boersma defining violence as more than that of a reaction to a threat or enemy or inflicting some sort of harm. Violence can be of other emotions or actions and not simply a reaction AGAINST something can’t it? The violence of love perhaps? Just trying to get my head around why I don’t see an enemy as necessary. But perhaps we are aiming at the same thing because even when there is a violence of say, love, there is also a forcible attempt at keeping out say, isolation or alienation. But it is more a forcible attempt to gain or keep something. And perhaps that in itself can cement a community. Something to strive for, not necessarily against. But if you’re for something are you automatically against something else? Perhaps.
Ramblings.

]]> By: Christo http://www.christodeklerk.com/2007/03/20/pick-an-enemy-make-community/comment-page-1/#comment-6083 Christo Thu, 29 Mar 2007 17:20:09 +0000 http://www.christodeklerk.com/2007/03/20/pick-an-enemy-make-community/#comment-6083 On whether an enemy is optional in forging a union of people, two european ladies have suggested quite strongly to me of the primacy of violence in human behaviour - rather they put it more like this: The history of violence is a necessary history. Violence, they argue, is not something contingent on the will of some class of people over the rest, rather it comes "from below." Since I think I'm somewhat honest with myself - I dare say I may indeed have it in me (worse than I'm sure I can imagine) to "act" in "community" with others and that meat is needed upon which to celebrate our sense of each other. On whether an enemy is optional in forging a union of people, two european ladies have suggested quite strongly to me of the primacy of violence in human behaviour – rather they put it more like this: The history of violence is a necessary history. Violence, they argue, is not something contingent on the will of some class of people over the rest, rather it comes “from below.” Since I think I’m somewhat honest with myself – I dare say I may indeed have it in me (worse than I’m sure I can imagine) to “act” in “community” with others and that meat is needed upon which to celebrate our sense of each other.

]]> By: Lindsay Bisschop http://www.christodeklerk.com/2007/03/20/pick-an-enemy-make-community/comment-page-1/#comment-5917 Lindsay Bisschop Thu, 29 Mar 2007 00:16:19 +0000 http://www.christodeklerk.com/2007/03/20/pick-an-enemy-make-community/#comment-5917 I read this post. I wish I could say I had something profound to add. I do not. Veronica makes a good point about the danger of focusing community on a common enemy. There has to come a point where community exists for the purpose of bringing people together because they were made to live together. I agree with Christo in that environmental fanatics can be help us to confront our apathy. I am not sure whether the knowledge of a "shared danger" is always necessary. However, that said, it is essential to have the awareness and commitment to action in order to create real community. I am not a fan of the question which "is the most pressing danger?" In certain cases, one threat is greater than another. It is important to have a willingness and desire to see dangers and act to correct or avoid issues. This doesn't add too much to the dialogue. But I thought i should make my presence known. I read this post. I wish I could say I had something profound to add. I do not. Veronica makes a good point about the danger of focusing community on a common enemy. There has to come a point where community exists for the purpose of bringing people together because they were made to live together.

I agree with Christo in that environmental fanatics can be help us to confront our apathy. I am not sure whether the knowledge of a “shared danger” is always necessary. However, that said, it is essential to have the awareness and commitment to action in order to create real community. I am not a fan of the question which “is the most pressing danger?” In certain cases, one threat is greater than another. It is important to have a willingness and desire to see dangers and act to correct or avoid issues.

This doesn’t add too much to the dialogue. But I thought i should make my presence known.

]]> By: Dave Vandergugten http://www.christodeklerk.com/2007/03/20/pick-an-enemy-make-community/comment-page-1/#comment-5889 Dave Vandergugten Wed, 28 Mar 2007 11:12:00 +0000 http://www.christodeklerk.com/2007/03/20/pick-an-enemy-make-community/#comment-5889 In the depths of anxiety and semi-depression, dialogue with the enemy is Promethean prayer. That is, wrestling the fire/life/existence from God. Tragic, because one debases oneself, defaces the Imago Dei, by stealing a gift out of its givers hands. The options of a failure: Go into a trade and start a band. Come to the realization that he is the two things he hated most, a flaming existentialist and a phoney. Quietly wander the sidewalks / sing on the bus. Smoke cigarettes and scribble poetry. Live vicariously through his children. And... advance the Kingdom of God somehow: find an enemy to kill him for defending the word of God. Easy enough; obey the One with ferocious zeal. But if he had done that in the first place, he might just have been responsible enough not to fail... "husha! husha! we all fall down." In the depths of anxiety and semi-depression, dialogue with the enemy is Promethean prayer. That is, wrestling the fire/life/existence from God. Tragic, because one debases oneself, defaces the Imago Dei, by stealing a gift out of its givers hands.

The options of a failure: Go into a trade and start a band. Come to the realization that he is the two things he hated most, a flaming existentialist and a phoney. Quietly wander the sidewalks / sing on the bus. Smoke cigarettes and scribble poetry. Live vicariously through his children. And… advance the Kingdom of God somehow: find an enemy to kill him for defending the word of God. Easy enough; obey the One with ferocious zeal. But if he had done that in the first place, he might just have been responsible enough not to fail… “husha! husha! we all fall down.”

]]> By: James Martin Moes http://www.christodeklerk.com/2007/03/20/pick-an-enemy-make-community/comment-page-1/#comment-5871 James Martin Moes Wed, 28 Mar 2007 07:03:00 +0000 http://www.christodeklerk.com/2007/03/20/pick-an-enemy-make-community/#comment-5871 The greatest enemy is irresponsibility. And, if I was faced with The War, I wouldn't go. And if I was confronted by him, I would sing Him a lament, and then later, a song. When he opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain because of the word of God and the testimony they had maintained. They called out in a loud voice, "How long, Sovereign Lord, holy and true, until you judge the inhabitants of the earth and avenge our blood?" Then each of them was given a white robe, and they were told to wait a little longer, until the number of their fellow servants and brothers who were to be killed as they had been was completed. (Revelation 6:9-11) (I didn't read everybody's comments: I apologize: typically, I like eavesdropping) Responsibility to the call, for He who has ears to hear, let him hear. - Don't ask me to tell you. - Why not? - - - - - - Oh. The greatest enemy is irresponsibility.

And, if I was faced with The War, I wouldn’t go. And if I was confronted by him, I would sing Him a lament, and then later, a song.

When he opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain because of the word of God and the testimony they had maintained. They called out in a loud voice, “How long, Sovereign Lord, holy and true, until you judge the inhabitants of the earth and avenge our blood?” Then each of them was given a white robe, and they were told to wait a little longer, until the number of their fellow servants and brothers who were to be killed as they had been was completed. (Revelation 6:9-11)

(I didn’t read everybody’s comments: I apologize: typically, I like eavesdropping)

Responsibility to the call, for He who has ears to hear, let him hear.

- Don’t ask me to tell you.
- Why not?
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- Oh.

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